Meet
Corbin vs. Sloan: Young Players’ Minutes
Posted by: Omar on March 11th, 2013
The author's views are entirely his or her own and may not reflect the views of the Utah Jazz.I have read some comments that suggest that Coach Sloan didn’t play young players like Corbin…..well there are a few stats that would actually counter that argument. For instance, from the year Jazz drafted Malone in 1985 until Deron Williams in 2005, the highest pick the Jazz had was a number 14th pick (Kris Humphries). So maybe Sloan NOT playing young players was because the majority of players selected were not lottery picks, and thereby, not high quality players. Yet despite this fact, there are still young players Sloan played that were non-lottery picks, but because they played basketball the right way—the Jerry Sloan way, they got minutes and Sloan played them. It’s hard to imagine Sloan would not love hard-nose high quality players like Kanter and Favors! Here are some facts….
Byron Russell (45th pick) averaged 16.7 minutes his rookie year.
Greg Ostertag (28th pick), a big, averaged 11.6 minutes in his rookie year and 23.6 minutes his 2nd year (on a championship team)
Shandon Anderson (54th pick) averaged 16.4 minutes in his rookie year and 19.5 minutes his 2nd year (both years on a championship team)
Jacque Vaughn (27th pick) averaged 9.3 minutes in his rookie year (championship year behind Hall of Fame PG) and 4.6 minutes his 2nd year (behind HOF PG)
Andrei Kirilenko (24th pick), a big, averaged 26.2 minutes in his rookie year and 27.7 minutes his 2nd year
DeShawn Stevenson (23rd pick) averaged 7.3 minutes in his rookie year and 16.9 minutes his 2nd year
Jarron Collins (48th pick), a big, averaged 20.6 minutes in his rookie year and 19.1 minutes his 2nd year
Aleksandar Pavlovic (19th pick) averaged 14.5 minutes in his rookie year and 13.3 minutes his 2nd year
Mo Williams (47th pick) averaged 13.5 minutes in his rookie year
Kris Humphries (14th pick), a big, averaged 13.0 minutes in his rookie year and 10.0 minutes his 2nd year
Deron Williams (3RD PICK) averaged 28.8 minutes in his rookie year and 36.9 minutes his 2nd year
CJ Miles (34th pick) averaged 8.8 minutes his rookie year and 10.1 minutes his 2nd year
Ronnie Brewer (14th pick) averaged 12.1 minutes his rookie year and 27.5 minutes his 2nd year
Paul Millsap (47th pick), a big, averaged 18.0 minutes his rookie year and 20.8 minutes his 2nd year
Kosta Koufos (23rd pick), a big, averaged 11.8 minutes his rookie year and 4.8 minutes his 2nd year
Eric Maynor (20th pick) averaged 14.0 minutes his rookie year (behind All-Star PG)
*Wesley Mathew (undrafted) averaged 24.7 minutes his rookie year, played in all 82 games (ZERO DNPs), started 48 games
Gordon Hayward (9th pick) first 3 games of the year averaged 20.3 minutes per game; November averaged 6.4 minutes per game; December averaged 14.4 minutes per game; 12.2 minutes per game in January; and prior to Sloan leaving 14 minutes per game.
CORBIN ERA
Derrick Favors (3RD PICK) averaged 20.2 minutes per game his rookie year (behind non All-Stars Jefferson and Millsap) and averaged 21.3 minutes per game his 2nd year (ditto)—and in his 3rd year is averaging 22.6 minutes per game (ditto)
Enes Kanter (3RD PICK) averaged 13.2 minutes per game in his rookie year (behind non All-Star Al Jefferson) and is averaging 15.5 minutes in his 2nd year (behind non All-Star Al Jefferson)
Alec Burks (12th pick) averaged 15.9 minutes per game in his rookie year (behind CJ, Bell, Howard, Watson, Tinsley) and is averaging 18.3 (behind Foye, Watson, Tinsley, and Mo) minutes per game this year
So it maybe the case that Sloan “didn’t play young players” because they just were not good enough, but as far as the hard working players that played Sloan type basketball, they got minutes despite being young, and in some instances on a championship team. Yet, our current lottery picks, hard working and high quality players, on a non-championship team, on a non-playoff team, are getting minutes less than Jarron Collins?! LMAO!!! Really, guys and girls, really……lol.
I’m not suggest Sloan should return (I’d rather see him coach some kids in college that want to work hard and learn, and not in a league full of divas), but to suggest that what Corbin is doing is the protocol of Jazz coaching is just flat -out inaccurate. If you play hard you play, no matter if you are a rookie that was drafted or undrafted….on Coach Sloan team that is; on a Corbin team defense is optional and working hard is good if you want to do that kinda stuff.
In a must win game tonight against the Pistons at ESA, Corbin vet basketball might cut it against a bad team, but against playoff quality teams, especially on the road that type of basketball is not good enough! That’s why Jazz after All-Star break, against 6 teams with winning records, 4 on the road, the Jazz lost all 6 games. That was the trend before All-Star break, but because Jazz had a winning record overall and in the playoffs, a lot of people overlooked, ignored, or excused Corbin ineptitude. That trend is just continuing as the schedule got tough; the bad thing is, trade deadline has past, and the Lakers have usurped the Jazz. So either Corbin is gonna change or this could get very ugly in a hurry. @OKC, Grizzlies, NY, @Rockets, @Spurs, @Mavs……if trend continues Jazz might be 5 games out of the playoffs by next week.
I guess we will see…..
Replies: 11
Views: 423
11 Responses
Kanter has to start getting more minutes, 15 a game is completely unacceptable! I think you are right Corbin has to go or the Jazz are gonna lose these young guys which should be their top priority.
J Collins is less skilled, but played tough and Sloan played him about the average of Favors and 6 minutes more than Kanter?!!
If Sloan had a tough guy WITH skill like Kanter, hed be getting like 40 minutes his 2nd year!!
And told a lot of people that Kanter could be a stretch 5 if he wanted too!!
I’m still waiting for Favors to be the guy that he looks like he can be, but lately Kanter has shown that given opportunities he can be a beast at least offensively and deserves more minutes. Favors deserves more increased minutes than he has found himself getting in the two years since his rookie year. Both deserve more starts, not just finding themselves starting when Al and Paul are unavailable. At the very least they should be starting some games where the opposing starting five are just poor. Other times they should be given the opportunity to start when the matchup for Al or Paul doesn’t look good. No one is saying they need to start every game, or even deserve to do so, but the fans and FO, and the players themselves need to see where they match up and if they can handle a bigger role in the future. The same goes for Hayward and Burks. The FO made a big deal about acquiring a pure shooter in Murphy, yet the guy hasn’t had any chance to show what he can do with any real minutes, despite certain players struggling to show any ability to score on certain nights.
Mo went down for two months. I think the Jazz shot themselves in the foot for this season when they did not go out and get Calderon. The Watson/Tinsley trial to replace Mo absolutly did not work. Those critical games lost during that time will be the killer. Also the games when Jazz were down to 9-10 players Murph still did not get more than one game garbage time. When the Jazz are out of the playoff race with a few games left will they still play Watson/Tinsley, AL/Sap??? Lets see the kids along with Evans, Murph, Leslie…
Watson is the guy that kills me! At least with Al and Sap someone can make an argument, but Watson over two years!! That is excusable!
I honestly believe if we flip the minutes of the rotation:
Kanter, Favors, Carroll, Hayward, Burks with
Al, Sap, Marvin, Foye, and Mo
Jazz would be fighting for the 3rd spot this year. We have our 5 impact players coming off the bench amd getting bench minutes and being allowed to close as a unit. To start the 1st, the 3rd, and to close. Even Carroll’s energy seems sucked being in the starting lineup and Marvin last game had the energy?!
Hayward plays well off of Burks, Burks plays well off of Hayward; Kanter and Burks play well off each other and DC plays well off of them. Energy level will be so high when bench comes in the energy level will already be high.
Its like a jigsaw puzzle the piece are there but Corbin just doesn’t get it!
Omar,
When has honestly believing something made it true?
Locke and Pelton have analyzed all kinds of Jazz lineups and what you are suggesting hasn’t been statistically any better than what Corbin’s done.
My best guess is Corbin’s coaching errors have cost the Jazz 2 games this season. Is that a lot? Not in an 82 games season. The players on the other hand through a lack of poise, poor decision making, selfish play, lack of experience, inconsistency and a few other things have cost the Jazz 5 wins.
Corbin has 5 assistant coaches and 3 of them are bench assistants. They’ve all played pro-ball and have other coaching experience.
Fans were falling over themselves to get Jeff Hornacek as an assistant. Well, he is on the staff.
Corbin and all of his assistants are blind and dumb? If only they could see what you see, they would finally find success in the NBA. Omar, that’s a rather big leap, wouldn’t you say.
I agree with some of your thoughts.
The Jazz have a big problem at PG and that’s what’s causing a lot of the problems. Now that Mo is back those problems are going to be even more glaring. Corbin gets it, but that’s who he has to work with. Almost all of the players on the Jazz have been very inconsistent this year. For a week Foye can’t miss and for the next two weeks, he can’t make anything. Corbin can’t shoot the ball for him. Sometimes Big Al shows up and sometimes he doesn’t, sometimes Favors takes himself out of the game with fouls etc. etc.
The biggest difference between the Jazz and the Spurs is consistency. The Spurs play consistently. The Jazz don’t. When the Jazz put their best game on the floor they are a very good team. Unfortunately, they do that on a very uneven basis. And you think a lineup change is going to fix that!
I know this post can’t penetrate your passion, so let me just get it over with for you and save you some time.
#FireCorbin
“My best guess is Corbin’s coaching errors have cost the Jazz 2 games this season. Is that a lot? Not in an 82 games season. The players on the other hand through a lack of poise, poor decision making, selfish play, lack of experience, inconsistency and a few other things have cost the Jazz 5 wins.”
“Your best guess”….pot meet kettle! Lol
“Corbin has 5 assistant coaches” —exactly! Assistant coaches. Who is the head coach? Who males final decisions? Why a team is struggling does the GM fire an assistant coach or the head coach? When a team wins a championship do they give credit to head coach or assistant coach?…..in that case, Pops assistance are championship coaches, so they are therefore better than Corbin hire one of them!
I love Hornacek, but I challenge you to find a post or comment were I wamt Hornacek as choach! Lol.
You ask “do I think a lineup change” will fix things….the head coach you are apologizing for thinks so!! He still messing with lineups! Lol! So YES changing the lineup will fix thing!
P.S we agree!!! #FireCorbin!
That plain ole stats show Sloan played youg players if they deserved the minutes. Can you explain to me how Watson deserves to play???
Omar, you’re the oracle!
Kanter, Evans, Marvin, Hayward, and Burks go on a 29 – 12 run!!!!
Happens every game, starters consistently start slow, bench makes a run!! Learn Corbin….Learn!!
Thank you Omar! Brilliant post!
Your welcome, Uottakno!