Meet
Rebuttal: “A closer look at Big Al”
Posted by: Omar on July 6th, 2012
The author's views are entirely his or her own and may not reflect the views of the Utah Jazz.Well everything was perfectly said by @Dallan in the other post taking a closer look at Al, so I’ll just supplement Dallan’s position by taking a closer look, and I will just add a few stats, and the fact that Al is in the last year of his contract, earning 15M this year (I don’t see how your highest paid player can be your worst defender, at the center spot no less).
Since Al is forgiven for being such a horrible defender on account that he is an elite scorer, lets look at Al’s 5 highest scoring games and Al’s 5 lowest scoring games (I only counted games were Al played more than 25 minutes and took double-digit shots) for last 2011-2012.
FIVE BEST:
Versus Cavs
W 113-105; 37 minutes; 13/17; 30 points
Versus Wizards
W 114-100; 31 minutes; 16/23; 34 points
Versus @Bobcats
W 99-93; 33 minutes; 11/19; 31 points
Versus Pistons
W 105-90; 36 minutes; 14/18; 33 points
Versus GSW
W104-98; 39 minutes; 13/18; 30 points
Only one of those 30 point games came on the road; 4 games against Eastern conference teams; all 5 games against lottery teams in the top seven; 3 games against the 3 worse teams in the East (against 3 of the worst 4 teams in the league).
FIVE WORST:
Versus @Lakers
L 71-96; 25 minutes; 2/16; 4 points
Versus Lakers
L 87-90; 43 minutes; 5/17; 11 points
Versus Clippers
W 108-79; 26 minutes; 4/14; 10 points
Versus @Mavs
L 96-102; 34 minutes; 4/12; 11 points
Versus @Blazers
W 112-91; 29 minutes; 4-14; 11 points
All 5 games against West teams; 3 games on the road; Jazz won 2 of the 5 games despite Al not scoring a lot; Apart from one blow-out, the other two losses where by a combined 9 points. 4 games against West playoff teams (the game against the Blazers was a must win late in the season and Al had a low scoring game).
Analysis:
If the goal of the Jazz is to make the playoffs, then yes, keeping Al is not a terrible decision. However, if the goal of the Jazz is to win a championship, navigating the West playoffs, then yes, keeping Al is a terrible decision. We all know he plays horrible defense, and add that to Al’s offense NOT being elite. Against playoff caliber opposition, Al really struggles; in the playoffs every team is playoff caliber, so a championship run does not look great with Al. Kanter will play great defense and will not average anywhere near 17.2 shot attempts per game (Al averaged 17.2 shot attempts and only averaged 19.2 points per game). Al is not efficient for a Center at all (50% for perimeter players is awesome, but for Centers average); Al (49.2%) is not even top-ten in FG% among Centers (Al is behind Chandler (67%), Howard, Pekovic, Bynum, McGee, Gortat, Monroe, Noah, Hibbert, Duncan). Trade Al.
Replies: 23
Views: 831
23 Responses
*all 5 against lottery teams in top ten; 4 against teams in top seven.
CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP!!!
So next year the Centers just in our division will most likely be
Hibbert, Mcgee, Pekovic, Perkins. I do not feel great about any of those matchups.
Look at the 5 Centers he was the best against. Tristan Thompson, Greg Monroe, Biyombo, Jeremy Tyler, Andray Blatche.
They are all young minus Blatche. So they are inexperienced so that is why he could take advantage of them.
Blatche is not young, but he don’t have a brain……. so, much easier vs him
When Jefferson has a bad night shooting there is no other way he contribute to the team because he can’t play defense and even when he does score there are 4 or 5 other players that could score above 50% and not need the half as much.
I would love to see Pekovic on the Jazz. I know Minny probably isn’t shopping him and if they were it would have to be a 3-way deal since they wouldn’t want to bring Big Al back. I’d like to see Pekovic split time with Kanter – those two would rough some people up down there.
To the point about trading Big Al, I am in favor of it. HOWEVER, I don’t think Kanter is ready to start yet, and may be 2-3 years away from it. So if we trade Big Al, I think part of what we receive back needs to be a center that can evenly split time with Kanter.
When Al left for his grandma funeral Favors and Kanter both showed they were ready for more minutes. What happens as soon as he comes back they go back to the 10-12 mins a game. Am I saying Al should have lost his spot cause he left? No but I am saying they showed they should get more mins and they did not get them.
Part of the problems I have with Al are brought on by the playing time and offense which is partly Corbin fault but the Jazz can not afford to have a 15 mil a year player on the bench. So KOC is also to blame in this whole debacle for even bringing him in. He tried to perform a band aid fix to make D-Will want to stay and the only thing it did is push him out the door even more.
Jefferson’s defense isn’t nearly as bad as people on here say; he is fairly awful against P&R sets, but his on-man defense was significantly improved last year and he consistently puts up solid block and rebound numbers. However, it isn’t hard to see why he succeeds offensively against inexperienced or unskilled opponents and not against skilled / experienced defenders. The guy basically has one move! Al has an exceptional up-and-under move and it’s his go-to. When it’s defended well, he occasionally tries for a cut across the basket, but more often just settles for a jumper (often a contested shot) from 15-18 feet. He does have a nice touch (as shown by his high FT % and VERY low turnover rate), but he still makes well under 50% of those unwanted shots. Algae is a legitimate top-30 player in the NBA, but he is not the foundation of a championship team because of his inefficiencies and easily exposed weaknesses which are exploited by the best opponents and any team which carefully scouts the Jazz and Al’s game.
Jefferson is NOT a top 30 player in this league.
I’d say he’s a top thirty, but on the lower end of that spectrum. He’s a fantastic post player, but unfortunately the Jazz offense isn’t strictly post play, so he’s not a great fit. And his defense is abysmal, though he clogs up lanes relatively well. I wouldn’t say he’s worse than Boozer, but not much better.
I have absolutely no problem with Kanter splitting time at about 50/50, but I do think is better for Kanters development to start with the 4 best Jazz players. Hell be the 5th option so no pressure on him to get the ball in the post and have to create with no shooters like last year. Id tell him play good D and clean the glass, dont over think, and then little by little run plays for him. Sitting on the bench with do nothing for him. Al makes 15M, too much for a bench player that cannot defend the P&R. Trade Al.
I saw Kory’s post last night and I couldnt wait to read Omar’s response. Well played Omar
Lamarcus Aldridge 21 ppg, 8 reb – JJ Hickson 15 ppg, 8 reb
Dirk Nowitzki 21 ppg, 6.7 reb – Ian Mahinmi 7 ppg, 4 reb
Blake Griffin 20 ppg, 10 reb – Deandre Jordan 4 ppg, 5 reb
Andrew Bynum 18 ppg, 11 reb – Pau Gasol 17 ppg 10 reb
Demarcus Cousins 18 ppg, 11 reb – Jason Thompson 9 ppg, 7 reb
Pau Gasal 17 ppg, 10 reb – Andrew Bynum 18 ppg – 11 reb
Al Jefferson 18 ppg, 8 reb – Paul Millsap 16 ppg, 8 reb
Above, the first name is a top big, the second player is the second best on his team. As you can see there are only 3 teams that have a better scoring and rebounding paint duo than Utah. If you take a closer look at those teams, you will see that the best teams also have an outside threat or two which makes it easier on their bigs.
Pau and Bynum have Kobe, Cousins had several, and Aldridge Batum, and mathews. Utah had hardly anyone shooting from the perimeter. As I watch what the Jazz are doing this season, I can see that they are trying for shooters. Guys who will open the paint. Too bad we didnt have them last season, but at least you can see what the problem is. We were playing 2 on 5 on the offensive end of the court. I konw you’ll argue that on the defensive end we played 4 on 5 because of Al’s lack of defense. Which side of the floor really hurt us? The 2 on 5 or the 4 on 5?
Eh, just a few things to think about. Bottom line is, Al is too expensive to keep. Wish we could keep them all, but in the future we wont be able to afford them. so its time to plan for the future, not the now. We still dont have the pieces for the now. Thoughts?
Kevin Love 26 ppg, 13 reb – Nikola Pekovic 13 ppg, 7 reb
Dwight Howard 20 ppg, 14 reb – Ryan Anderson 16 ppg, 7 reb
Kevin Garnet 19 ppg, 10 reb – Brandon Bass 12 ppg, 6 reb
oops. Missed a couple on my cut a pasts.
I don’t think we can trade Al with his huge contract and defense or lack of defense. I think we will have to play out the year with him and in another year Kanter may be able to start. Hopefully with two training camps, summer league and two years under his belt Kanter will be ready to be a solid starter.
Could happen, but what about teams like Atlanta or even Orlando if Dwight is traded off? There are still teams out there in need of scoring and or cap space next season. Just a thought..
Omar, when did you say you and Dallan were getting married? I hope I get an invite. You guys are sooo cute together.
What a shock that we lose to LA (in LA) when Al only scores 4 points. You forgot to add how many rebounds Al had on the 5 “worst” games where he only scored 11,10,11 and 11 points. Where there 3 or 4 Double Doubles in those games?
The funniest thing about you so called “rebuttal” (heavy on the butt) is you have never offered a solution to replace him. I’m sure you think that we have a legitimate chance at bringing in Dwight or Bynum but we don’t. At least I have said that I would like to see Hibbert, Monroe or Jordan take his place if we could move him.
He isn’t a perfect fit for our team but his supporting cast was pretty weak sauce last season. Kanter isn’t ready to be our starting Center. I will repeat myself once again. Keep him until the mid season trade deadline 1) to see if the coaches can help him realize that he has other guys on his team 2) let his teammates prove that they are worth passing to. If things aren’t working out at that point, then trade his expiring contract.
Please don’t waste your time rebuttaling everyone until you come up with a realistic SOLUTION to the problem. Trading him and having Kanter start will not lead us to a championship
Starting Kanter this year won’t lead to a championship nether will starting Jefferson but in a couple of years Kanter will be better than Jefferson so why not start developing him.
One of Al’s problems on offense is that he doesn’t get to the free throw line so it takes him a ton of shots to score his average.
HAHAHA!!!!!! Kory, Kory, Kory,…….hahaha, first name calling, now implying I’m a homosexual!! This coming from a guy who has as his avatar a homoerotic crotch shot of John Stockton?!! Kettle meet Pot. Your homoerotic avatar emphasizes the middle of Stockton’s shorts through triangulation (the number 1, the number 2, and the middle of his shorts); that is why when painters paint women in the nude her breast and genitals form a triangle, where the flow points down in emphasis (the “nudes” usually are covering their faces with their arms or object). Consciously or unconsciously, that is what you have selected as your avatar (you could have just included his face, so the picture flows up, emphasizing his face). I am a HUGE supporter of GLBT community, so I really do not find homosexuality offensive, but I still find it hilarious how some males take such a hyper-macho and archaic stance on homosexuality, and use it for insults. If your projecting Kory and want to read homosexual weddings and butts (“heavy on the butt”?! hahah WHAT?!) in my post about Jazz basketball, that is cool, I will not judge. Just know that when you are ready I will be here waiting for you with a big hug. Can you imagine yourself at a gay wedding?! You would be the drunk guy trying to fight everybody, not cool. I don’t think you will get many invites to gay weddings with such a nasty disposition.
AND back to basketball……
Kory I CLEARLY premised my argument:
“Since Al is forgiven for being such a horrible defender on account that he is an elite scorer, lets look at Al’s 5 highest scoring games and Al’s 5 lowest scoring games (I only counted games were Al played more than 25 minutes and took double-digit shots) for last 2011-2012.”
If I am looking at his “elite” scoring ability, then WHY would I include rebounds??? The only valid info would be scoring, FG%, FG attempts per game. All I read is how we can not lose Al because our offense will crumble to pieces, and I say no. Al had 2 of his worse 5 games against Dallas and LA, and the Jazz only lost by a combined 9 points (and what a shock we WIN @LA with Al having a DNP); Al is not the be-all-end-all. What is interesting is how people point to Al’s FG% and compare it to perimeter players (49%) and highlight what a great FG% Al has, but they do not compare him to other centers who shoot over 60%. Chandler (67% FG) averaged 5 shots to get 11 points; Al averaged 17 shots to get 19 points (ratio: Chandler would take about HALF the shots Al takes to get ALL the points Al gets). You cannot tell me Kanter cannot average what Chandler does, 5 high percentage shots to get 11 points)?? Al takes 12 more shots than Chandler to get 9 more points—not efficient. Not elite and not efficient for a center. So some will say, “hes a scoring center.” Okay, lets compare him to scorers: the 7 players that take more shots than Al are top-ten scorers in the league (6 are 1-6, and 7th is number 9 scorer), Al is 16th. Basically, only 7 players take more shots than Al, yet 15 players average more points than Al?! Does not add up, unless Al is not an elite scorer and is inefficient. Pretty much, if any average center took as many shots as Al, they would average as many points as Al, so then why are the Jazz paying him 15M for something an average center can do?? McGee, yes McGee, takes 9 shot attempts to get 11 points, so if he took 18 shots he would get 22 points. Kanter has a better Offensive game than McGee, If Kanter took 18 shots, in his 2nd year as an NBA player, Kanter would average like 17 points, and get paid like 4M.
I HAVE suggested alternatives, a ton!! Jason Thompson (his offer sheet is too much now), Kaman, Camby, Kurt Thomas. Kanter and Favors split center minutes, Millsap, Favors and Evans split the remaining PF minutes.
And thanks @disco, and @JRN (for always using stats to defend Al, and not resorting to insults), not like other Poo-Poo Caca Face Doodie Pants!!!
Hey guess what Kory we do not need replacement options since we have TWO NUMBER THREE OVERALL PICKS sitting on the bench. Maybe Kanter is not going to bring us a championship this year or next but Jefferson is never going to bring a championship here as long as he is starting,taking up a third of our cap space, and playing horrific defense. If you bring in a cheap 5 to take 10 mins or so that is what we need. So like a Henry Sims guy on our summer league.
Omar, you made me laugh with tears for 10 minutes. You are a hoot. Now I really cant wait to come to the wedding.
I am on the other hand concerned that someone who noticed the triagular position of an avatars genitals is offended by a homosexual reference. I think most people would see a pic of John Stockton’s classic #12 jersey and maybe half of those would laugh as they reflect on how hilarious his shorts were.
I don’t even drink buddy, so unforunately I wouldnt be the mean drunk guy trying to fight anyone. Sorry to disappoint. My comment wasn’t at all hyper macho. You and Dallan just seem to agree on everything, even when your points are invalid. Lova ya man! Hugs and Kisses
Hahaha Kory!!! Thats basic art theory and philosophy of aesthetics, Renaissance painters were all about Geometry. Im not making that up! Hahaha. Thats how paintings or photos get balanced. haha.
I dont drink either, buddy!! Best Friends Forever XOXO!
P.s. Trade Al!!