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Game 44: Jazz 114, Pacers 110 (OT)
Posted by: TACOREV on January 27th, 2013
The author's views are entirely his or her own and may not reflect the views of the Utah Jazz.The Jazz hold on to beat Indiana (26-18, 10-15 away) in overtime after blowing an eight point lead in the final two minutes of regulation.
Jefferson led all scorers with 25, Millsap scored 21, Hayward finished with 15 & 6, while Foye added 14 for the Jazz.
David West, Paul George, and George Hill scored 24, 23, and 22, respectively, for the Pacers, while Roy Hibbert posted 14 & 12.
Indiana actually out-shot and out-rebounded the Jazz, but turned the ball over 22 times leading to 28 Utah points.
Speaking of turnovers, Hayward had a rough stretch to close out regulation, coughing the ball up three times in the final minute. He did have a big defensive play late in the extra period, but injured his shoulder in the process. X-rays were negative but reports list him as day to day going forward.
Watson registered the third-most minutes on the team (31). Meanwhile Burks gets a DNPCD.
Back to getting out-rebounded. The deficit was 41-28, and our starting front court only managed 10 boards in 75 minutes. That’s pretty terrible. A “Big” should manage at least one rebound for every four minutes on the court. Hibbert alone grabbed 12 in less than half the playing time (35).
But hey, the Jazz came away with the W against a respectable team (although not a great road record) and improve to 24-20. They’ll stay home to host Houston on Monday night for game two of the four game home stand.
Jazz player of the game: Al Jefferson
Replies: 29
Views: 605
29 Responses
Someone can explain to me why Tinsley was on bench last minutes??? that´s why Hayward has those turnovers at end…
Player of the game: Millsap
That was a very sloppy game. Hibbert looked like he gased out late 4th/OT, had to put West on Al. Pacers were the 29 scoring team ib the league, and before OT, already scored about 10 points over their averages. Pacers are have the worse team FG%, and yet, managed to shoot 54%!! for the game. The Jazz just cannot play defense.
As of today, the WIZARDS have more wins against teams with winning records Blazers, Heat, OKC, Hawks, @Nuggets, @Blazers, Bulls. The Wizards have beat TWO West teams with winning records on the road, the Jazz have ZERO.
Winning ugly can only get you so far. And play bad D will get you nowhere.
How great is the chemistry between Favors and Hayward! They got the sizable lead late into 4th quarter; then of course after Hayward dish to Favors dunk, and great momentum……Corbin subs in Al, and the Pacers make 7 FGs in row, and eventually leads to OT.
Counting down til trade deadline.
Jazz wins against teams with winning records:
Rockets, Nuggets, Spurs (Dec 12), @Nets, Heat, Pacers.
The Wizards have more wins against West teams with winning records than the Jazz. Jazz have not beat a West team with a winning record in about 6 weeks—never on the road.
Come on Omar, that was a good win and you know it. And I know it hurts you and I to say it, but Watson and Al won the game in OT.
Don’t you remember last time we played them and got absolutely shut down? This was on the 2nd of a b2b and the Pacers were rested.
Big Al was pretty bad for most of the game, so we probably shouldn’t have needed OT, but we wouldn’t have won without him once we got there. Watson played his best game of the season by far. Question: Would you rather have Watson or Tinsley as the 3rd pg? It’s become a much more difficult question as of late.
The one thing I don’t understand is playing Marvin. I thought the justification of him playing would be that he scores better than Carroll. But Carroll has completely outplayed him as of late.
Hayward and Favs looked great tonight. I’m a bit worried that Hayward’s TOs late may drop his confidence the next couple days. Too bad, because I thought that 1st one was a great pass, and the last TO he got hacked. Kanter needs more time, and more plays for him to get some jumpers off.
@Omar 6 weeks sounds awful, but in that time we’ve only played GS, Clips x 2, Denver, and Memphis, of which only 2 were on the road. Probably should’ve won 1 or 2 of those, but that’s all apples off the cart now.
@Andy, I never said it was a bad win, I said ugly. Even if Pacers won, it would have been an ugly–cuz it was an ugly game (both teams came in back to back game, losses). 35 TO in the game.
The point I was making about the 6 weeks was not about duration, like its been a long since Jazz have beat a West team with a winning record, I was making the point that in this stretch of winning going 9-3—none of those wins were against West teams with winning records. So lets keep it in context. Otherwise the same people that propagate the idea that “Corbin bench Howard, CJ, Bell, Watson so the Jazz can make the playoffs, etc.”
Im gonna always put it in context, especially before the traded deadline cuz otherwise people will feel a false sense confidence in a mediocre team, and we will keep Al and at best lose in 5 games first round.
@Omar sure the pacers shot 54%, but that doesn’t mean the jazz played bad defense, just poor shot defense. The Pacers had 22 turnovers, 17 of those were steals, which shows how active we were. The hands were active and we playing hard, anyone watching the game that watched the lakers game knows it was night and day effort.
Another positive, is how well we played offensively against the Pacers highly ranked defense. Indiana is a Top 3 defense, and the jazz played very well on that side of the ball for about 46 minutes of the game.
It was an entertaining, very competitive, back n forth game. This is an excellent win against a greatly coached team, i like Vogul a lot and think he is a great young coach! And this was on the back end of a back to back no less. Good win.
The Jazz started the season poor without getting any real winning rhythm, no one can argue with that, but lately they have done what it takes to win on most nights. They can only beat the teams in front of them. The Atlanta loss was a bad one. The Lakers game was horrible considering how they had been playing, but other than that I have to give the team credit. They have been blowing big leads and having to fight to the death in games in games they shouldn’t have but they have been coming out the other end ok. In the past 12 games they have been getting the results they have needed to get and all without Mo.
When Mo went down I was worried that during our easiest stretch of the season so far, that they might lose a few games that would hurt them later on in the season but the guys are sticking together and winning ugly. That is a lesson for all of them, and will help them later.
Back to last nights game, I for one, am glad the Pacers had a good shooting night, had they been a team that couldn’t score last night they would have made it an uglier defensive game and the Jazz don’t do well on those games. When teams try to hold the game close and just want to go point for point the Jazz really struggle. That is another lesson that the Jazz have to learn.
I hold my hand up and and say Jefferson came through again last night. I thought had the Pacers played the game the way I thought they were going to Al would have struggled to get anything useful for the Jazz last night, but he came through when we needed him. As did Watson. Watson has no threat himself but he was on the end of things 3 times last night that prevented the Pacers getting easy points when the seconds were going down. As much as I was screaming last season for Hayward to be tested at backup PG he still has a ways to go before he knows how to use the ball at Point when the game is close. He allows players to get too close. Not once. Not Twice. But 3 times. Other teams would have really punished that. Burks has similar issues in that regard. Tinsley and Watson wouldn’t be my first choice as PG’s but they do have that knowledge that creates the gap between man and ball. Thats not on their stats buts its very much needed. As is knowing how to move your men around. Watson is constantly barking orders getting his pieces moving around the floor. Hayward could have done the same before he turned the ball over for the first instance.
Given the amount of time Watson had he didn’t have too bad of a game but for that time others could have done more
On another front Rondo just tore his ACL and is gone for the season. No more trade hopes for this player.
Again, the Pacers are the worse and last worse offensive scoring and offense FG% teams, so ya they got 21 steals, but a lot of that was from sloppy played game. Both teams, it looked like preseason. When you allow a team to shoot about 12% better than their average, you will not be able to beat the top 4 teams in West. Which is my issue.
If you are okay with being a mediocre team that will squeeze into playoffs and lose in 4 or 5 games, then ya of course its a win, and the status quo is okay—keep course. I want a championship, that where our perspectives are different. I have not see much in these last 12 games (despite 9 wins) that lets me think, “hey this Jazz team can win a championship by playing Al and Watson 30 minutes plus against OKC, Spurs, Clippers, Grizzlies, maybe even GSW.” But yes, Jazz at home can beat some decent teams. I want to be a championship contender by next year, otherwise I see Favors getting a fat contact from Bulls. If I were Heat Id offer maybe less and tell Favors, “hey youll get less money but you will be staring C for Heat and compete for championship—or you can play with Watson 20 minutes behind Al on a borderline playoff team”.
Im looking ahead, not at one game where Al played well, and Watson didnt play like complete trash.
A game the Jazz tried so hard to lose. If the High School kids I coach gave up that many offensive rebounds they would be replaced and torn a new one. I was happy to see corbin leave Hayward in the game for OT after the shocking few mins at the end, as Andy said hhe was worried about his confidence and hopefully that final block helped.
@Omar, understand where you are coming from. Favors fully deserves at least 35 a night and if he can’t get them in Utah, why not go somewhere else?
But just to clarify from earlier, the Pacers weren’t on a b2b. They hadn’t played since Wednesday.
@omar i’m pretty sure every fan wants to win a championship, so there’s no point in accusing other fans of not wanting their team to win. thats just silly. We all want to win a championship just as badly as you do buddy.
But i also think its important to come to reality… We aren’t going to win a championship and, the bigger issue we all can frustratingly agree upon, is that a championship is not the goal this year either.
BUT I have no problem with giving the team praise lately because i feel its been our young guys that have really stepped up and carried us, particularly Hayward. I feel Gordon has taken the next step in his career, he is playing very solidly and is now making “all star” type plays. But of course, Favors, who continues to be a major factor on both ends needs more time.
You can only beat the teams on the schedule, so i’d much rather them be getting these wins than not. AND we’re doing it withot Mo.
Again….
If you (general “you”)—in other words, if you are a person (non-specific) that is okay with the Jazz being a first round exit, then make zero moves: no trades, no rotation changes nothing, keep the course. I cant read into any of your heads hearts, if thats you, thats you. I can no only assume that if the Jazz keep Al thats the goal for the Jazz over the next 4 years. So in a year why their is talk about Jazz traded Favors cuz he hasnt signed and his agent (which he should do) wants to test FA, our championship prospect go down the tube. Hayward might stay, but if Jazz plan on keeping Al and Millsap, Favors is gone.
The thing is the Jazz have a hole in the PG position. Being not bad is not being good. Jazz have a log jam in the frontcourt, Al is a horrible Defender…….the point I am making is that the Jazz although have won some games against bad to average teams, the teams still has significant problems. So why not improve your interior D by dumping Al and playing Favors and Kanter more, while improving the PG position?! Seems like common sense to me, but thats just me.
Basically, if the Jazzs wins are taken out of context the Jazz FO might be less inclined to make a move, which after Feb 21 will at best lead to a first round exit. Im looking at the complete picture of Al and Watson, not just making a statement bout one game. Just like I wouldnt want CJ resigned cuz he dropped 40 in one game. Whole picture.
Hello all, been away for a bit, busy with my new little one.
@Omar: Agree on all points!
I honestly, really, truly hope that the Jazz FO is trying to get the most value possible by playing Al and Sap max minutes and showcasing them. The chemistry developing between Derrick and Gordo is encouraging to see. Its a glimpse of the future of the Jazz, and a very promising one at that. I suppose the I, and the rest of Jazz nation, have to be patient and hope the FO are playing thier cards right to be able to make a move before the deadline.
The young guys are ready to be given the keys and to start the new era of Jazz basketball. If we let Al and Sap walk in FA…fine. Now if we cant sign an impact FA to alliviate that loss…not so good. Even with the $$ we’d have to throw at one, we all know big names dont want to play here. One or both, Al or Sap need to be dealt to bypass the chance that that happens and to give Favs his deserved starting spot.
If we are able to see the whole picture, i’m pretty sure guys like Dennis Lindsey & KOC do too. If they wanted to make a trade, they would. There is plenty of interest in Millsap and Al to have made a move or make a move in the future. One thing we know, is they keep things very quiet. They traded deron williams out of nowhere, so obviously they do work the phones. I want us to make a deal as badly as the next guy, omar you know i love that kemba trade, but until we do, we still gotta try to enjoy the victories as they come.
These guys have a plan(and a freakin lame one at that) and they are sticking to it no matter what. Its frustrating as hell but it is what it is.
We all want to win a championship, and we all know its important for us to start beating better teams. But we also need to take care of business.
I agree with most of the points here. Omar, I think that your main point is very valid. I would only modify it in that I think that it is unrealistic to think that we could compete for a championship, next year, in almost any scenario. I totally agree with you that this year’s moves will be very telling on how serious the FO is into producing a championship caliber team.
With how this team is constructed, with all of the expiring deals, its obvious to me that they are turning the team over to the young guys next year. I hope i’m not the only guy that thinks that, because we went through something similar not too long ago.
This is the same situation we were in with boozer & millsap 3 yrs ago, when sap was outplaying booz but we continued to play booz solely for his offensive talent all the way through his contract, once it expired we then turned it over to Sap.
I would be absolutely shocked if they bring back both sap and al, also, I would not be shocked at all to see neither of them return. I am guessing we bring back Al, mostly due to the fact i think Sap takes the biggest deal and the jazz wont want to beat it.
Whats up River J!
Im happy, Im just saying Al and Watson getting 30+ minutes will not win a playoff series. GSW went from 7 pick in lottery to the 5th best team in West with an All Star—and the big reason is cuz they dumb Ellis and let their youngs develop. Im just warning against being content with Al (and Watson): we moved from 8th seed to possible the 9th seed (I said the Jazz didnt kick Lakers when they were down they will make a push for 8th)?! Is that progress???
And remember…Favors and Hayward are in last year next, so lets say the rationale is NEXT year Jazz will turn tean over … well who is to say Favors wont bolt?! Hayward wont bolt?! They should think about that. If the Heat or Bulls offered Favors 10M to be on championship team, wouls you blame him for leaving?! So next year the talk will be should Jazz trade Favors or Hayward cuz they have not signed long term and might leave FA? So basically, if Jazz resign Al, they are buildings around Al, cuz Jazz will be 8-10th seed while Favors and Hayward are on expiring contracts.
Now you see why Hayward CANT play point guard….and he didn’t make a defensive play in the end, the dude coughed up the ball by himself……..Without Jefferson the Jazz are a lottery team…but hey, then they can try to find another great white hope….
Sell the team to Sacramento or Seattle it will solve everyone’s problem with this organization
@ austin better than following blindnessly. Sports orginizations love fans like you. I wanna believe the Jazz have a master plan! I also want to believe they see through Corbin. But I have my doubts! @jazzman Hayward shouldnt have to play pg and you cant hold a couple of plays against him. If we had anything better than Watson he could be play his own position, and play it exceptionally. Hayward is a baller and been great. I dont know why your knocking him. We Will be just find without Al detriments. You can follow your hero to his next team!
Sarcasm get to know it a little
Jazz will let both Millsap and Jefferson walk, and probably sign Brandon Bass and Joel Anthony or Marcus Camby. Favors will continue to come off the bench, and Kanter still won’t get 15 minutes a game.
Then they will offer an extension to Earl Watson and Marvin Williams.
Omar, even if the team got Chris Paul in the summer the team won’t be a Championship contender next year. It has taken him two years to put the Clippers into that position, and that team already had a good group of players to work with. We are not going to suddenly leapfrog OKC and San Antonio in the space of a few months with a few extra players.
Personally I’m hoping that the team are doing their due diligence with the 8 expiring contracts that they have and are aiming high with the type of players they are targeting. If the team is able to move Al on gets at least one big name player to this franchise then it make it all the easier to resign the likes of Favors and Hayward, and build a team around them. If I was the FO knowing that we need a PG I would make every play I could to get Chris Paul here, until the day he resigned with the Clippers or moved on to Dallas or where-ever he may end up. This might be the one and only opportunity that this organization ever gets the chance to make that play. When has this team ever had the level of cap room opportunity that it has at this season? We complained for years about overpaying for Kirilenko and what that did to our ability to go after players. Now that the team has this situation the team has every right to take its time to be as ambitious as it can be and go after its highest possible targets, not just a play that moves Al on to allow Favors and Kanter more minutes. Or a play that gets us something better than Tinsley or Watson. The team has to exhaust that opportunity until the play can no longer be made. Then you move onto other targets, but every player that isn’t Chris Paul is probably going to be that bit less ambitious. I hope our FO is as ambitious as the next team. You know if Dallas or the Lakers get a whiff that Paul isn’t resigning with the Clippers they will make a play for him, and our FO team should be trying to aim that high too, especially after that have set it up that they have all that cap room if certain players don’t get resigned.
Personally if it was me, I would be working on that deal, with other targets in mind in the likelihood that the deal can’t get done. I would also be working away at Toronto to try and get Calderon here now. With Mo here we need a PG, the two of them could run the ship together when they both healthy and Calderon could resign in the summer if we don’t get the PG that we want and aim to get a star player in another position with the rest of the cap room.
The sad fact is the Jazz need a PG and we have been spoiled in the past with the likes of Stockton and Dwill but there are very few PG’s in the league right now that are instantly going to take this franchise to the next level. Some of the names I see mentioned here on a day to day basis are not going to have that impact and we are not going to get him here by trading Al and Millsap. We might have to be ambitious aim high, and if that fails just bring back someone good at the PG position and look for the franchise changing player at another position. As much as I am keen on Favors, he’s not proven anything yet. The potential looks sky high I’ll grant you but he’s done nothing yet to suggest that he is that franchise player. He is still developing his game, we can blame Corbin for the distribution of the minutes but at the same time Favors has to really step up and start producing in a way that we can stop talking potential and instead has the league taken notice not just us Jazz fans.
@ Steve, GSW went from 7th worse team in league to the 8th best team in the league…..in LESS than one year! They have a first time young head coach as well?! So whats the difference?! And CP3 who you obviously like and consideres to be the premier PG in the league…..GSW has beaten them 3 times this year, along with beating OKC and @Heat. They will not be favored to win a championship but they have proven they can beat rhe best teams in the West….in less than a year. The Jazz has more talent overall than GSW, so why the difference?! Its possible to be a contender in 18 months with the right moves and right development. But ya we are behind schedule, and losing time cuz of Corbin and FO.
Everybody needs to understand Favors and Hayward will be in final year of contract next year. So ya that mentality that “what has Favors show”—well firstly, considering he gets 20 minutes a game, how much more can he show?! And that attitude is why Favors should leave the Jazz high and try: Bulls will dump Boozer and sign Favors so Tibs can have a dream D front court of Noah, Taj, Favors. If Jazz want to play chicken will Favors itd be one of their many mistakes. Im sure Pacers will pursue Hayward, and why wouldnt he want to leave a team that is losing its young talent to FAncy so that Al and Watson can lead Jazz to first round exits—at best.
How tragic will it be if Favors ends up w Nets and him and DWill fight for titles while Lakers and Mavs reload and GSW, Rockets, Blazer improve and Jazz are picking late lottery over the next 4 years wih Al as our franchise player. No thanks.
In my opinion the GSW are just a middle of the road team they aren’t a title contender yet. Getting wins in the regular season against good teams doesn’t prove anything. To me you have to prove it once the playoffs come round. I consider San Antonio and OKC our target if we aiming to be a championship contender. We have to beat those types of teams over 7 games if we want to consider the Jazz as contenders.
Despite wins against the Clippers and OKC, the GSW have only a few extra win against teams in the western Conference that the Jazz do. A team that you say is the 8th best in the league has only two wins more than the Jazz. I grant you that GSW started the season really well, by their standards, but the Jazz are catching them up, as is Denver. GSW started the season with an easier schedule and they took advantage of it. The Jazz have an easier schedule now and they too are taking advantage, hopefully the Jazz use this run to build momentum for the rest of the season.
I want the team to win now. Like you I’m impatient for success. I want at least 3 of the so called core four to be resigned. The way the team can do that is by being ambitious. Today and tomorrow. Not just trading for a player that allows our young players more time on the floor. We need to sign players that show our ambition to win and win more than we are winning now. Then if Favors and Hayward want to sign on then great we might have a championship contending team, not just some fifth, sixth, seventh, eighth best team in the West. Its not going to be easy. When Denver lost Carmelo at the same time as we lost DWill they signed their players to contracts then they traded some on. There is talk they might trade 3 more of their players to get two players back. It takes time to build a team.
@Steven I see what your saying, but I was comparing GSW against GSW. They went from 7 worse to 8th best, thats a 15th team jump. Point is Jazz can make a jump just like that.
As much as I think that the GSW benefited from an easier schedule at the beginning of the season I didn’t consider them as a bad team last season. They had the ingredients to be a borderline playoff team last season but as soon as the season looked lost they went on an artificial losing streak that made them look worse than they actually were. Good for them they ended up with the draft pick the Jazz should have got.
Personally though I think Al is lazy enough as it is. 2 years of first quarter losses with him in the team is bad enough to take as a fan. I don’t want to see the team that I watch lose more than it needs to. I want the team to do what it takes to win now. In my view I see too many teams that have talent in their squads but lack the nuance to win and that talent and potential is wasted as a result. Losing becomes habit. The losing habit breeds laziness. As long as all these players are here I want the coaching staff to use them in any which way that they can that creates a winning habit, with an eye on the future. I don’t think Al should play first quarters. I think he should be ripped out of the game if he isn’t shooting well. But he is here, he is part of the squad and he does have a part to play in the teams success.
I tend to think that the coaching team isn’t making the most of its squad. The coaching of this team frustrates me no end. I think it might be the coaching team rather than the FO’s ambition that means we don’t get the targets that this team needs.
I don’t buy that we will get better instantly by not aiming for the playoffs and just putting our effort into developing the core four. I don’t buy that potential is developed just from minutes. A losing culture can inhibit potential.
I agree with a lot of what you say about Al and Corbin, but I think FO needs to be ambitious and aim high in its player targets and not just swap average player for average player so that its frees time to play the core four. We need players that really help the core four takes their games on. I think Hayward is showing signs of doing that by himself. Favors is inconsistent, one night he is good on the defensive end, next he might have a good shooting night and other times he’s just not good enough considering his potential. He needs to step it up, whether he is frustrated with Al being here or not. Kanter is showing signs that he has that range that we read about before he arrived here. With time on the floor and plays designed for him maybe he could be as good offensively as Al. If he started defensive rebounding again like he did last season he could be better. I don’t know what to make of Burks. He seemed to me to be like a slasher that could penetrate a defense and bring some sort of threat when the Jazz needed it, but he seems to be too soft. I don’t see him having PG material yet, against bad teams sure anyone can. As an individual scorer he could be useful but if he’s going to go all the way to the basket he needs to learn to finish if he’s going to get fouled. That to me is his value. If he can finish he can rack up plenty of 3 point plays. If he doesn’t learn to finish he might be as valuable as CJ’s jump shots.
The team needs to build a winning mentality with what we have now. We cannot have players accepting defeat. Some years we are going to have to rely on draft picks to improve this squad, but this summer we could make some plays to get players that will take the talent of this squad on. Playing the young talent, and losing games isn’t going to show our ambition. Favors isn’t going to stick around if he is getting 35 minutes and losing. You and I agree that Al isn’t the answer, Favors needs to start showing that he is.